here in CA ( once part of Spain) are here to work.

They are the ones doing the hard labor in the fields, the factories
and tending to suburban gardens and children.

They came here because they could not find work in their home
countries. Ask them, and you will find 100% of the time the answer
is " No trabajo en_______" ( no work in _______)

Many of them have been here for decades and contribute to our society
and economy.

Many, many of them become citizens of the United States.

I partly agree with you.  Illegals shouldn't be moving here and getting more benefits than US citizens.  No free hospital care, no government handouts.  I also agree that we have to stop the flow of illegals.  But there are some pluses in this situation.  For one the immigrats from Mexico that we now have do, excluding drug dealers and criminals,  help our economy by doing low paying jobs most Americans wouldn't do.  Two they oftan start busnisses, restaurants and grocery stores, that they are paying taxes on.  Three they are a big buying segment of the country, houses, cars, TV's, stereos, computers etc., and they are paying state tax on that.  Fourth and the  most important, these illegals that work here are having State Tax, Federal Tax and Social Security Tax taken out of their checks every week, but at the end of the year, because they are illegal, they are not allowed to file for a tax return.  Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..........................that is several million dollars a year that the government is making.  What is that supporting? Maybe our Social Security Fund for example. So there are pluses and minuses to this situation, but the most important issue is not to give handouts to the immigrats that are already here.  If they want money they must work for it like the rest of us do.  And no free health care.

unlike legal immigrants, there are no health checks for the illegals. They come to us bearing the free gifts of diseases that we have forgotten about. Only if we want to keep these dreaded diseases out of our cities, towns, and hamlets, is healthcare provision worthwhile.

Walled cities for the wealthy do not prevent the spread of disease. Isolation in ghetto-like communities do not prevent the spread of disease.

To protect ourselves and our children(posterity)it is necessary to treat everyone and to make sure that even the illegals are immunized.

You can be quite selfish about it. If we give them healthcare, we stay healthy. Another positive note in the battle for single-payer healthcare for us all.

One billion dollars a month are being expended on this illegal war. Which do you prefer to spend that money on?

A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.

Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623

The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.

Imagine an America in which I would be forced to support killing people against my will! 

I live in Las Vegas NV.  What I see daily is that the illegal immigrants have little or no respect for the Law ( big surprise) They are indignant if you don't speak mexican spanish!  They now consider themselves aboriginal people! ( yeah right) Aboriginal to mexico, not the SW USA.  They do take jobs that US citizens want.  (ask my daughter who can't get a job because she doesn't speak spanish)   The laws won't work if you don't enforce them.  We don't need new laws we need to enforce the ones we have.  We have to criminalize the people who employ illegals.  If they have no job prospects then they will come here legally, case closed.  Not all people who come here as immigrants do so illegally.  I personally know 3 people all from different countries who are here legally, who have to go though the long reams of paperwork  to live in this county and work in this country legally.  They abide by our laws and they are happy to do so.  They earn a desent wage and they own homes and pay taxes, etc.  The illegals take jobs for less pay, no benifits, and sometimes don't get paid at all, how is this good for them or the US citizens who wanted that job ( and yes they did want that job).  I have seen over the years that more and more illegals are working in offices, and on construction sites where just a few years ago they used to be US workers.  The only people who benifit are the greedy corporations and business owners who do not wnat to pay decentwages and benifits and want their own profits to rise.  Take away the jobs by crimnalizing the employeers for hiring these people and then they will not come to work if they are not approved to be here, they will have to come here legally to work, it is a simple plan, it must be enforced to work, and there lay the problem, enforcment....we the people want this, but they the corporations and corporate owned politicians don't! The laws are already there but no one enforces the law.

I do not claim to know all that you have listed, but I do know that we used to say the Pledge of Allegance every morning in school and now we don't. I do know that there didn't used to be a problem with having the Ten Commandments in public places such as government offices etc, and now we do. I do know that there used to be prayer in schoold and now there is not. I do know that we have 'In God We Trust' on all of our currency, and now there seems to be a problemn with that and someone is trying to get that changed. This country did alright all those years with these things and now this country is in SERIOUS TROUBLE! We were told we could not whip our children when they did wrong. I was whipped and I didn't turn out too bad. I haven't killed wanyone, nor have I abused anyone. I work and pay my taxes and I vote. Look at our youth today. It scares the heck out of me that they are our future.

In any regards: Democrats have had ZERO power for 6 years in the Presidency, the House, and the Senate. We can't do anything.

But you're correct, that before that, they did have some power AND things were better. Still, I hear ya. There are elitists in the Democratic Party centered in the DLC that I would not vote for.

But why worry about illegal peasants when it is rich bums who have your money and therefore your security? The vast majority of professions have been losing out to upper tier professions for quite some time now. I think its time the dogs stopped eating the dogs and went after something meatier: the leisure class.

Just a thought.

The Canadian border is as porous as the Mexican border. Only difference is that most of the illegals coming across from Canada are northern Europeans. They also use false SS numbers and other documents. They take regular jobs that even Americans are willing to do. No one suspects them because they are fair-skinned and most speak English well.

As to the flying of foreign flags--whats the harm. Would you then deny the flying of Irish flags on ST Pat's Day? I can think of all the other flags that represent who we are--most of us, those at least who know who their grandfathers were and where they came from, have a number of flags that we could proudly fly.

We are a nation of immigrants. There were no people here on this continent originally. NONE. Of course, if one studies immigration history, one finds that the English objected to the Irish/Scotch immigrants. They, in turn, objected to the later mass immigration of Germans, and French. And then we all ganged up on the Polish and Hungarians et al. Finally, the ruckus caused by our Asian imports(cheap labor)caused no end to laws passed from the 1880s on and ending with the 1924 Asian exclusion acts.

Americans should be proud of their country. I agree. But, can any American be proud of what America is today?

Misplaced mindless patriotism is just exactly that. It was nice to see however, the replacement of the rebel flag with American flags flying from rusty pickup trucks.

We must be very careful just whose ox we gore...it could be our own.

A mind once expanded can never return to its original dimensions.

Anne Hathaway: 1556-1623

The greatest derangement of the mind is to believe in something because one wishes it to be so.

Louis Pasteur

Well, let's build a BIG wall with our southern neighbor. Would you feel safer? "Terra-ists" aren't as dumb as Republicans, they will cross the Canadian border. Actually more terra-ists have been stopped at the Canadian border but it's the Mexicans we blame. Those damn Mexicans should be providing us security because we don't want to send tax money to enforce laws.

All immigrants came into this country legally? What history book are you reading? You think people crossing the boarder should be "processed"? What in the world does that mean? I have traveled Europe and I wasn't "processed" at every country. Let's talk about how much we process illegals - Ramzi Yousef was allowed to wonder the country but told to be in court for an immigration hearing that he never showed for - what a surprise! Why was Moussoui so different? They supposedly picked him up BEFORE 9/11 (but knew nothing about approaching attacks) on an immigration charge but didn't deport him.

Who said that everyone crossing the boarder wants to be a US citizen? US citizens cross the Canadian boarder for cheaper Rx drugs - but they return home. Latinos are just looking for a job with wages they can live on. And how dare they display their flag! What ignorance. Did the ex-Iraqi's in Michigan offend you when they waved their Iraqi flags during the invasion? I drive to work and see Irish, French and German flag symbols on people's car - I guess you should be ashamed of your heritage now - the only thing that matters is America. I guess you are a BIG supporter of John Bolton at the UN - how dare they fly flags of other countries, this is the US and I see why he wouldn't mind 10 stories falling off the building - those damn flags.

"They want the federal government controlling Social Security

- George W. Bush in a debate in St. Charles, Mo., Nov. 2, 2000

The problem with all politicians is that if their lips are moving, they are probably lying. While running for an office, they all tell the voters what they want to hear and then when in office, they seem to forget what put them there.
>>>>Totally agree, that is why I disagree with the latest ad that says don't vote till you see what your representive plans on doing.
Everyone should check completely HOW they have voted on the things that we are concerned about before voting!

Also, on another note...as a gun owner, I will vote whomever is going to allow me to keep my guns. I do agree that some guns and ammo should be banned, but not my hand guns, or my rifles and shotguns used for hunting.
>>>>Agree again, there should be a ban on the guns that are only intended to KILL.

I am not against immigrants coming into our country. I am against them coming over the borders like thieves in the night.
>>>>EXACTLY

they should be stopped at the border one way or the other! If we should ever be attacked on our soil again, I for one will be wondering if the persons guilty of the attack, came over the Mexican border. Doesn't this worry you? If not, it should.
>>>>This certainly does concern me and your right if anyone is not - THEY SHOULD BE!!!!

There is a bad side to calling/declaring by law the illegal immigrants felons.

Instead of removing them, they will be sent to privitized labor camps/prisons paid for by our tax dollars. It is yet another way for the few elite to profit.

When they get out of jail, they still won't be citizens or be able to vote. It's a dead end for them and us.

The black folks came here against their will. That is not true of the illegals.

First, recent illegal immigrants the break the law when others are waiting at our door for entry. They start off on a bad foot of being a good citizen.

Many refuse to learn English and want their own culture within our borders (want the land back). This has never been the case with previous immigrants illegal or not. They wanted to be "one". If we are not "one" we will be like Canada with division and power struggles within.

In Miami, English speaking Americans have claimed they can't get a good job unless they are bi-lingual.

Our minority population were just making it in our society and now we have an even larger population who need education, benefits, and aren't discriminated against. They have to compete with each other for jobs and benefits like college education.

Have you not read about the problems between the blacks and Mexicans in the CA jails? The drug problem across the borders?The Mafias in the big cities because of the lack of jobs, etc.?

Yes the elite divide us but there is a bigger problem of too many immigrants at a time when we can't absorb them into our already failing society. Americans of all levels of education and training are having a hard time in our country because of out-sourcing and poor government management for the last thirty years (since Reagan set out to destroy our government and society for the few).

A Hispanic immigration group was on CSPAN saying many of the older generation of immigrants (here legally) have not fully absorbed into our society. They haven't seen the "American Dream" come true. It takes at least two generations for them to have that dream and be "one".

One Congressman said it right. We can't allow whole countries of people to migrate from one place to another looking for the basic needs while the few live better than kings. It is like the failing Roman Empire. They so destroyed society, governments infrastrutures, culture, education, etc. that it took over 400 years for it to recover. The Romans left behind religious wars too.

Illegals also come across the Northern border(not as much as the Southern but they do come). They visit Canada from India, etc. coming as visitors or tourists and acrossing that way. They enter our ports and airports from all over the world and don't leave.

Even if we wanted to return them...we can't. Bush has so devisted our federal infrastruture there are few employees and even less money. This was done for his World "Dis" Order government.

Empire leaders take everything for themselves leaving criminal/devistated/poverty/war torn societies. Today, they leave depleted uranium, biological polution, etc. too.

For the first time in our history people are "leaving our country" to flee our Police State. They want their children safe and to have a future. That has slowed down because it is not just our country any more but a world removal of rights and increased poverty because of the WTO sending good jobs and companies to the 3rd world. Of-course the thuggish CEO live here in luxury. Read the book "No Place to Hide".

Mexican elite have denied their citizens a good living/survival so they come here. NAFTA only made it worse with removal of huge numbers of farmers who were thrown off their lands. Neither they nor us are better off since NAFTA. It was a big lie by the few.

If you don't live in a major city or near the Southern border You have to know this is a problem for all concerned. Have you not listened on CSPAN and CNN-Lou Dobbs? Go visit LA or Miami... big city.

Bush's removal of our rights and wealth from everyone to the few is like that of a Dark Ages Medici family (also religious tyranny).

We have to stop the world wide privitization and globalization by the few Robber Barons (leaders all over the world who think themselves above anyone's laws...by example of our President). They meet behind closed doors and steal every thing for themselves. Many have billions of dollars and at least three homes and their own jet. This power/wealth of the few is not new to history.

Over population on earth is another subject the RWers won't talk about. On one hand they want large families (for their religious group and power) on the other they want them to be "self sufficient" in an ever growing stressed world.

In order to have stability and a healthy society (in any country) it has to be lawful, peaceful, and democratic. You will have a large middle class with the few poor and elite but it will be better for the whole. Most people want to stay near their families and build a good life.

Congressman Dennis Kucinich, like President George Washington, is right to ask we have a Department of Peace. Peace and prosperity is just that. That includes everyone regardless of race, religion, sex, or social status.

What about construction workers, sports figures, etc. are they all low wage illegal immigrant workers?  They replace every level of pay in this country....lower but not necessarily slave wages.  

What happened to bring them up to our level? It seems to me the goal is to bring us down to slave wages. 

Bin Laden didn't remove our way of life and freedoms....Bush, Inc. did.